Insane Gear Requirements


#1

WARNING: Unbelievably long wall of text. Players, there is a TL;DR at the end if you don’t want to read it all but I suggest you to do so. PerBlue, I strongly encourage you to read every word in this post, bring it to your next meeting, and break each paragraph down so you get the full message, and everyone knows how we feel about the insanity that is gear.

Between the high stamina cost, exponentially increasing gear requirements, and the frustratingly low drop rates of needed gear in the Campaign, gear is unfathomably difficult to farm. Combine that with how many heroes need all the same hard-to-get gear, and you have a lot of people who think that ranking up heroes is so much more difficult than it needs to be. In this post, I will be critiquing nearly every source of gear drop in the game and I will offer suggestions on how to make it better. I highly suggest that you heavily consider these suggestions and even if you don’t implement them, do something LARGE to alleviate the gear grind.

I will more or less leave the Trials alone. In the last update, I think you guys did a good job in changing the way the gear drops. My only critiques here would be maybe switching out some old gear we don’t need anymore, like the Candlestabra scraps, for something that still often comes up, like the Fairy Ferns. And suggest doubling the drops permanently because I always seem to need the drops and can never get enough. Otherwise, good job there.

Next up, Dungeon. I am unbelievably frustrated with the Endless Dungeon and the way gear drops work. Most heavily required gear drops on a very small floor range. For example, Polymonocular scraps are some of the most frustrating scraps to obtain. In the endless dungeon, they drop on floors 61-64. That’s right. This highly required gear scrap is only available to drop FOUR FLOORS in the endless dungeon. Once you get to floor 65, you’re basically not getting any more polymonocular scraps in the dungeon. At that point, you gotta reset the dungeon and get up 60 floors to get to the four floor range, where you will inevitably get less scraps than you hoped for yet again, continuing the cycle of despair that is the endless dungeon. So I suggest reworking the way gear drops in the endless dungeon. My first suggestion is removing the upper floor bound on the gear drop. For example, instead of having the Polymonocular scraps drop from 61-64, have them scraps drop from 61+. Now, don’t do this with all gear, because I don’t wanna see Pungent Beans dropping on floor 70. Only remove the upper bound on heavily required gear scraps. My other suggestion would be to rework the way gear drops after floor 70. At floors 70+, only O+5 scraps drop. Nothing O+4 or below is dropped in the entirety of the endless dungeon after that. This is terrible. My suggestion here would be to drop heavily required gear at floors 70+, regardless of the rank. Be they Polymonocular scraps, Sand Witch scraps, Manticorpse scraps, whatever. Make us want to dive deeper and deeper into the dungeon. I can say with 100% certainty that I am not the only player who resets the dungeon after completing floor 69. I know that the Dungeon shouldn’t be the only source of gear, but at least make it helpful.

With the Boss Dungeon, chests drop rampant, so I’ll spare you here. I’m satisfied with the boss dungeon drops more or less. I’ll say the same about Epic Dungeon too. But I will say something about critical successes for the Endless and Epic Dungeon. THEY ARE USELESS. For being so rare, they almost are never worth it when they do come up. In the Endless dungeon, 50% of my crit successes have been pony shards. More specifically, 5 pony shards. I have 400+ pony shards that I will never run out of. This is not helpful in any way. My next most common drop from crit successes in the Endless Dungeon are Murse Scrolls. Not even the full item (which I still don’t need) but just the scroll. Do you have any idea how degrading that is? I finally come across a jackpot chest and it gives me an ingredient for an item I haven’t needed for over a year. Crit successes not only need to be increased, but their drops need to be increased too. When I get a crit success I need to see red dots on the scraps I get. I need to see full items with the red dots. I need to see diamonds. I do not want to see pony’s face or blue scraps. Yes, I still see blue scraps in crit successes. It would be nice to get epic scraps in crit successes in the epic dungeon. For the rarity of the crit success, getting epic scraps (plural) would be worth it. Please get this together PerBlue.

This was something I was thinking about recently, and is only loosely related to the main topic, but while I’m talking about the dungeon and making it more interesting, I have this suggestion. What if there were other types of chests dropped in the dungeon? Say, after floor 80 or something, the Endless Dungeon can drop Overstuffed Chests or Heroic Chests or Gold Chests or Dungeon Chests? They don’t have to be common drops (don’t make them frustratingly rare) but something else to motivate players to get to those deeper levels? I think more players would dive deeper and spend more time in the dungeon if they knew they could get 100K hero XP or Dragoon Shards or 2x dungeon drop boosts or stamina packs. This would be a fun addition that I think many players would stand behind.

Next up are the gold chests. Gold chests are frustrating for a number of reasons, but for now I’m only talking about their gear drops. I hardly ever get useful gear from the gold chests for them to be worth much. They’re hard to get and rarely deliver when you do get them. When I’m not getting two hero shards from a gold chest (which is very often unfortunately), I get 10 orange scraps that I don’t need. This is not helpful. Now I know that you can’t do too much because the top people have an abundance of gold chests that they could use to get gear if you make them too good, but it would be helpful to concentrate the drops on things that we do need, so we can see some red dots come with the gear that does drop. I almost never get full orange gear drops in gold chests, much less ones that I need. Even if you have to make 3 more gold chests perk levels to make this happen, make this happen. Please.

Next are War Boxes. War Boxes have always been disappointing. The rewards don’t even amount to a fraction of the effort of three months in war, vying against other powerful guilds for the top spot in the game. A couple Overstuffed Chests and Campaign attacks could get me an entire Season Rewards’ worth of loot. If we put three months’ worth of effort into war (which every single high-ranked member in any war-participating guild can attest to being a lot) we expect three months’ worth of rewards. Instead of having us choose between 3 different choices of 10 orange scraps (which we probably won’t even end up needing anyways), give us the choice between 3 different groups of 5 full O+4 items. That’s worth three months’ worth of war effort. Let us choose between 100 Panther Stalker, 100 Dragoon, and 100 Lion Knight shards. That’s worth three months’ worth of war effort. (Some might even argue that’s not worth it and I can’t say I won’t agree). You still have a week before the end of the war season for S1. Ramp up those War Box rewards a ton. Please don’t disappoint us yet again.

(After typing the last paragraph about gear requirements, I’m coming back to say that we need to see full O+5 gear in these season rewards, coming in groups, not singles. I need to be able to choose between 3 Slitherwhips, 3 Sands of Thyme, and 3 Sparkbeetles. You have no idea how hard it is to grind this gear.)

I’m gonna leave all the shops alone because they’re not supposed to be good sources of gear. I only occasionally spend my tokens on gear, and I never, ever drop diamonds in the Trade Ship or Dragon Shop. It would be nice if they occasionally offered full gear for a high gold cost, but I know that will probably never happen so I’m letting it go.

Last but absolutely not least, Campaign. Here we go.

The Campaign is the primary source of gear. If you need a specific piece of gear, you go to the stages where you find their components and attack them until you get what you need. But what happens if the gear scrap you need is only scarcely available and has abysmal drop rates? That’s the unfortunate reality of literally every single player who has played, does currently play, and (hopefully not) will ever play this game . Once again, bringing up the Polymonocular Scraps as an example. I absolutely detest this scrap because it is the hardest scrap to get (imo) but one of the most widely needed. I detest this gear on so many levels and I groan whenever I see that a hero needs this scrap for some gear. Not even counting if they need it two or three times. Polymonocular is listed as a drop in only Chapter 13. (it is also a secret drop in stage 16-2, but the low drop rate does not justify the high stamina cost, so you’d do better, albeit not by much, in Chapter 13.) It’s unfortunate that Chapter 13 has the most required gear scraps in the game, but most gear scraps that are listed there do not appear in any higher chapters. We all know that similar gear drops more frequently in the higher stages. For example, the Cthsphinx Jar scraps are available in Chapters 10, 12, and 14. They drop the most in Chapter 14, so this is the best place to get them. But when the one place you can get a gear scrap drops it in frustratingly low frequency, you don’t know how furious players can get when they see it’s needed 20+ times throughout their heroes. Not counting how more it will be needed at higher rarities. So when O+6 inevitably comes and Chapter 18 of the Campaign comes with it, here’s what we need to see in it: Pocket Horror scraps, Polymonocular scraps, Sand Witch Scraps, Manticorpse scraps, Fright Light scraps, Aleicorn Scroll scraps, Grim Mace scraps, Compass Rose scraps, Unicorn Tears scraps, Melted Armor scraps, Fright Light scraps, Helmet of the Sparkly Legion scraps, Shell of Gamrah scraps, Exact Change scraps, Chilletto scraps, and maybe some House of the Flying Stabber scraps. In case you don’t know, I just listed the scraps that most players find themselves constantly needing (ignoring anything that appears in the Trials). If any players feel that I left something out, please comment on it and I’ll add it in. And to PerBlue, if you feel like that’s too much, most of those scraps have been neglected in campaign but overused in recipes. It’s the least you could do for us. And please don’t make this next chapter unlock at TL 121. It’s very annoying having to wait a week to get to the new campaign. Make it unlock at TL 120 so everyone can enjoy it right off the bat.

Lastly I want to touch on the exponentially increasing gear requirements. I refuse to let myself believe that you guys are intentionally make this gear grind as difficult as it is. I will bring up the Slitherwhip as an example. The Slitherwhip is an O+5 gear that requires Slitherwhip Scroll Scraps (50), the Light Cube {which requires the Melted Blade [which requires Melted Blade Scroll Scraps (50), the Fright Light (which requires Fright Light scraps (50)) and Unicorn Tears (which requires Unicorn Tears scraps (50))], Walrus Armor [which requires Walrus Armor Scroll scraps (50), Ninja Spinners (which require Ninja Spinner Scraps (50)) and the Belt of Many Holes (which requires Belt of Many Holes scraps (5))], the Fright Light [which requires Fright Light scraps (50)], and the Manticorpse [which requires Manticorpse Scraps (50)]}, the Stable Stool {which requires the Stable Stool scroll [which requires Stable Stool Scroll scraps (50)], the Pocket Horror [which requires Pocket Horror scraps (50)], and the Fright Light [which requires Fright Light scraps (50)]}, and the Stuffed Bacon {which requires the O’Rhyleh’s Boop Stake [which requires O’Rhyleh’s Boop Stake Scroll (which requires O’Rhyleh’s Boop Stake Scroll scraps (50)), the Shell of Gamrah (which requires Shell of Gamrah scraps (50)), and the Uncomfortable Pauldron (which requires Uncomfortable Pauldron scraps (5))], the Shelly’s Boop Stick [which requires Shelly’s Boop Stick Scroll (which requires Shelly’s Boop Stick Scroll scraps (50)), the Respectable Ambassador (which requires the Respectable Ambassador scraps (20)) and the Minion Teeth (which require Minion Teeth scraps (5))], the Ninja Spinners [which require Ninja Spinners scraps (50)], and the Dwarven Beard Flute [which require Dwarven Beard Flute scraps (20)]}.

That was an absolute pain to read, right? Imagine how painful it was to type it. Neither one of those can even remotely compare to how painful it is to grind it. This item alone requires 150 Fright Light scraps, among thousands of other scraps. As if it’s the only gear to need Fright Light scraps. Oh, absolutely not. And that’s just a singular item. That’s not counting all the other items that the one hero needs. Or all the other heroes that need that one item. (For the sake of my sanity I will refrain from saying the last one but we all know what it is.) I could point to any other O+5 gear as an example (and I was originally going to mention more but typing out that recipe completely mentally exhausted me), because they’re all similarly painful. The only other O+5 gear I will mention is the Sands of Thyme, which requires (among other things) an Avocadorantula to craft it. The Avocadorantula is an O+5 item itself. The Sands of Thyme is an O+5 item that needs another O+5 item to craft it. Dragon Heir needs both of them. Please, PerBlue, tell me that this was a mistake. Tell me this was not intentional. I haven’t even mentioned what each of them need to craft, and I don’t want to look because I don’t want to dishearten myself any further. Basically, O+5 gear consists of a bunch of O+4 gear, which consists of a bunch of O+3 gear, which for some reason seems to consist of a lot of P+3 gear. And I’m sure that when O+6 gear comes out, it’s gonna be a bunch of O+5 gear. PerBlue, you have to realize how daunting this task is for all players, from F2P to your biggest whales. Typing this all out really puts into perspective the requirements for these heroes, and it actually made me somewhat depressed to know that this is what’s coming. (I’m still trying to get my heroes to O+5. O+4 itself is still really daunting to me.)

PerBlue. We all are suffering because you fail to realize the intensity of the task of upkeep. With constant level cap increases, new heroes, and new rarities, upkeep is becoming exponentially more difficult for even high level spenders. So imagine how difficult it is on your free players, who get no extra stamina packs for campaign and no extra hero XP to level heroes up. There is no word that describes the level of insanity of the task you have put on us. Knowing that O+6 is coming soon (and S1 Alliance people know what’s next), you need to increase gear drops SIGNIFICANTLY and decrease gear requirements for the next rarities because this is a lot. PerBlue, I strongly encourage you to implement everything in this post and even more. I have contemplated leaving several times and typing this post out only put you guys on a time table for me and for many other players. I strongly encourage you to implement these changes quickly, for the sake of not only your game, but also for your fan base if you want them to still play any of your games.

Sidenote: I don’t even want to open the game right now because typing this all out has really put this gear grind into perspective. I always knew it was insanity but not until I typed out the paragraph about gear requirements did it hit me. And oh, how it hit me.

TL;DR: boost gear everywhere. Gear grind is unbelievably difficult and it will only get worse. Dungeon needs significant gear rework and so does campaign. Gear requirements are getting insanely high and I now get anxiety when I open the game.


#2

I want higher rates of carob chips :+1:


#4

War boxes werent as good as they could’ve been …maybe instead of the choice of 3 items … How about all 3 for however many war chests you won … so assuming 1st is still 25
25 chest = 75 items = 3 months work

Gear is beyond scope for me at o5… Ill get it finished but it’s rough !
I have a team of players lower then me struggling their butts off to make ends meet and having to really go into accountancy mode regarding what amount of consumables they should use today and save some for the incoming contests
The pq economy has flaws but working together we can rectify all that :wink:


#5

Thank you. Thank you, thank you, thank you so much for posting this. While I’m only a player on S3, and spent only a small sum of money a few months ago on the game, I understand the pain. We just got orange +4, and I am a level 106 and have 3 heroes to orange +3. None of them anywhere near maxed out. And I’m leading a top 10 guild. Dungeon is out of the question for me, as I’m starting high school tomorrow and already don’t have the time on my hands to do it. It’s insanely time consuming and doesn’t offer anywhere near a good enough reward. Even epic dungeon, which I can stand, I don’t have the time for. The rapid cap raises are an insanely clear money grab, and it’s ridiculous. RIDICULOUS. Perblue, I have seriously considered quitting this game many many times, now more than ever. I’m only around at this point because my Guild needs me. But if you don’t start listening to your players, eventually, they will all go. And then how will you get your precious money? It’s clear that’s all you want, but the way you’re doing it isn’t actually the way to get it from us. I’m so disgusted by the way you treat your players and don’t plan on spending another cent on this game, even if some serious changes are made. Even though I know I need to if I want to get ahead, you’re despicable. Fix these issues, and the many others wrong with this game, or you’ll end up with a problem on your hands.


#6

Thank very much for going to the trouble of posting this!! I was planning on writing up a similar change to war boxes but this is so much more thorough. I would like that post a thousand times if i could.


#7

Thank you so much for succinctly stating what so MANY of us on S1 are dealing with.

Per Blue, you would be very wise to read and digest all that was said here. There are MANY of us who are about to throw in the towel because of what is described here. Lots of us don’t want to, but will have to for our own sanity.


#8

Succinctly put, yes.
Remember when a dead man’s chest was the worst item?

200 slingshot
80 hammers
20 of the other thing

300 scraps for one item.
I miss those days…

The last time I raised this issue that the number of scraps were impossible for f2p, and asked how anyone would gear a hero without spending, O’rlyeh suggested “patience”.

Yeah. Thanks for that, per blue.

Orrrrrrrrrr…
You could stop making items that need 1000+ scraps.
Please.


#9

I attempted to visualize what @Hgtgdfhh listed above for slitherwhip. I am a project manager with IT background so i wanted to see it laid out. I spent way too much time doing this because it is a game and i ran out of space in MS Visio where i started. So i went to MS Excel to speed up the process and try to fit everything in where i could take a picture for this forum. Adding up all the scraps needed takes 450 orange + 340 purple + 15 blue for a total of 805 scraps to grind. All this for just 1 gear on 1 single hero!!!

In my humble opinion, 1 of 2 things must happen:

  1. STOP cap raises until further notice (which we all know won’t happen).
    OR
  2. limit the total scraps needed for a full gear to 300 (or around that).

#10


image
When O2 came out, I created a spreadsheet to see just how much was needed to get everyone geared fully. I wanted to break it down so I could be very efficient with the stamina used to get all the gear. 29,275 scraps… O5 is so far beyond that…
Patience doesn’t work with gearing. Once a new rarity comes out, your toons are hitting with nerf swords until you get them geared. F2P can’t gear that quickly and stay competitive.


#12

Does it help that I have formulas in there, so you can fill in what you already have…?


#14

Can you isolate a specific set of heroes, so that you can work out exactly you need to build your meta line… @LoOLoO ?


#15


Like this?


#16

Uhhhhh… why are you discussing this here Mici and Looloo?


#17

It’s very relevant to the discussion…


#18

@Fire_III it’s very clearly about gear requirements

@LoOLoO so Will that then break down the number of scraps of everything you need…?

If I had any hope of ever having the stamina to collect this much gear, I could see myself building that before I started.
Most impressive.
What is the actual o5 number of shards? :wink:


#19

A few msgs ago from you Mici it sure wasnt lmao.
I like the charts you got going Looloo, but thats a lot of… formatting?


#20

haha I gave up after this one. It was too depressing.
But yeah, you can fill in how many gear slots are needed, and fill in what full gear pieces and scraps you need.


#21

Formatting was done so you can clearly see which gear go to each item since 99% of the gear is a “recipe” and not just single items


#22

Amazing work. But that had to been painful or a lot of time spent.

Which enforces the original post, PerBlue…


#23

I am in world 8, not even remotely close to any of this but reading this makes me want to quit right now, because I know I will hate this kind of grind so much. Please make the drops scaled with the level cap or something similar like that. Like is mentioned above, at a certain point the server shouldn’t need blue drops anymore. People that are new join new servers anyway.